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Wednesday, February 06, 2008

Delegate Count? Exclude Super Delegates.


Delegate Count? - Originally uploaded on flickr by stevegarfield.

Update: 2/6/08 1:47 PM
MSNBC.com


Update: 2/6/08 6:22 PM
CNN Politics.com


Checking the delegate count at USA Today, Time.com, CNN Politics.com and MSNBC.com I can see why people are confused about where the 2008 Presidential primary race stands. While compiling these results two of them changed within 15 minutes. By the time you read this, they'll probably be different. I think all media outlets should EXCLUDE super delegate totals since they can vote any way they want and are not guaranteed to vote they way they might be leaning today.

Related:
Political Wire: Delegate Count
The Nation: Obama Claims 9-Delegate Win for Super Tuesday
Slate: Momentucrats vs. Arithmecrats

Update: 2/7/08:
WSJ: Delegate Numbers Are All Over the Map

10 comments:

  1. Man, the more I learn about the election process here in the US the more I confused I become (and start to see how undemocratic it actually is). Between the super delegates, the electoral college etc seems like a carefully controlled system that winds up presenting the two candidates who work the system best not necessarily the two best candidates for the job.

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  2. I can't find a state by state breakdown of delegates anywhere! I had been using the CNN Election Center but it seems to be broken. The New York Times also had a reliable state by state plot but they haven't added the Super Tuesday delegate results yet.

    I'm getting aggravated and a little paranoid. The major media outlets seem determined to spin this as a win for Hillary Clinton. However, based on a complete lack of information, it looks like Obama took more delegates.

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  3. Anonymous5:53 PM

    It seems as though CNN is excluding super delegates for this reason

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  4. Trustfall6:28 PM

    Here's a link to the state by state breakdown:

    http://www.cnn.com/ELECTION/2008/primaries/results/scorecard/

    Keep in mind the delegate count includes delegates and superdelegates.

    This whole superdelegate thing is ridiculous. Has anyone really done the math on this? In the democratic party, there are 4,049 delegates total. 3,253 are "delegates" and 796 are "super delegates." Each super delegate is literally one person (i.e. member of congress, ex-president, etc.) The regular delegates are essentially rationed out proportionately based on vote totals by congressional district, by state. So here's the bottom line. The super delegates make up 20% of the total delegates. This means the entire country (us, the voters) have a 80% say in electing our nominee, AND 796 PEOPLE HAVE A 20% SAY IN ELECTING THE NOMINEE. Someone explain to me how this makes any sense???

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  5. Superdelegates are reversible; they can change their minds. Other delegates are not reversible. So for clarity, they should be reported separately.

    That said, both kinds count.

    As for the previous comment opposing the whole concept of superdelegates -- I disagree. Superdelegates are people whose personal achievement in getting elected has established them as experts in electability. That's an important criterion for a nominee.

    CAM

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  6. Two comments: one, the system was rigged this way because there was some thought early on that there might need to be some check on the citizen's vote, in case they do something crazy. Undemocratic? Yup, but so is the rest of the election process. Majority of voters voted for a liberal in both of the last two elections, but since their vote split across multiple people, conservatives won. Conservatives are better at holding their nose in the polling booth, and voting for one person.

    Secondly, if the citizen delegates are close but one candidate has one more, and the Super delegates but the candidate with fewer delegates over the top, there could be some serious uproar. Picture people in the streets. People in this country, esp. Democrats have had enough of having the final outcome taken away from the citizens.

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  7. mccoy8:38 PM

    If this delegate crap turns into watergate Im moving too the republican party, that way at least you look intelligent instead of looking like the only one that doesnt realize we live in russia.

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  8. Anonymous11:17 PM

    Report This! Beware Democrats!
    Why do Republicans hate Hillary Clinton?
    Because the Clintons have beaten Republicans at every turn, bringing prosperity to all segments of our society (not just the privldeged few) throughout the 90's!
    Why do Republicans want Obama to be the nominee?
    They know they can defeat him. The Limbaugh's, Coulter's , Mathews and Drudge's pander to and indulge the Obama bandwagon now, but they see raw red meat for the butchering. The Republican sleaze machine that has exhausted itself and lost to the Clinton's sees Obama with his rawness and inexperience a welcome sight!
    Don't be naive! Proven competency trumps charisma in the real world! There are no quick fixes!

    Hold that though The Media is blocking your mind Vote Clinton
    George Washington would flip in his grave if Obama should win

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  9. Anonymous2:10 AM

    Why does CNN show on its
    broadcast board and on its
    website that Hillary
    Clinton won Michigan and
    Florida?

    How can a candidate
    "win" 2 States
    that the DNC and the candidates agreed to not
    count and to not campaign
    in because of "rules violatons".

    Obviously, Obama would have won Michigan by a landslide like in South
    Carolina if he had not
    agreed to remove his name
    from the ballot(very large
    African American vote there). Florida would
    have been a tossup.

    Hillary is promising to
    get those delegates
    seated(to presumably vote
    for her)?

    The only fair way to do it
    is to revote in Michigan
    and Florida or to have
    Caucuses in those two States. Otherwise, it
    will look like a
    "back room deal" to ignore
    the voters and favor Hillary which could split
    the Democratic Party and
    throw the election to the
    Republicans.

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  10. Anonymous4:57 AM

    Guys, The Republicans are extreamly smart people. I have to agree that the Clintons have beat the Republcans at EVERY turn, and in the process allowed this country to have one of the most prosporus times in our History. The the only tool the Replublicans have against Hillary is to try and split the democratic party; if she receives the nomination. If they Do that, The only thing I have to say to you guys who vote replublican is "SHUT UP AND PAY AT THE PUMP!!" The Republicans are salavating for Obama, and now that Ralph Nader is in the mix, If Obama is the Democratic candidate, we will have a replublican white house.

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